Firstly, apologies and thanks to CO for the thread title mimicry (sincerest form of flattery mate... and possibly indicative of a lack of creativity and imagination on my part)!

Secondly, I'm very new to this, only posted a couple of times but I hope to post more and more as I gain experience. Please see my introduction in that sub forum for my back story if you're interested.

And so it begins.

I went out last night with CO for my second sarging session, which he has already written up in his FR. I am going to post my own thoughts and reflections on my experiences, in the hope that this will become like a journal or diary. Please feel free to make comments and criticisms, post advice or ideas, and perhaps my memoirs may even help some people too.

I had been out before with CO but we were in a larger group and this time it was just me and him. We met at about 10pm and went around a few bars and pubs to see what we could open.

I only had one objective, which was to open some sets, speak to some randoms and continue addressing my AA. I don't want to try and run before I can walk, CO said to me 'babysteps' - and he's absolutely right. On the whole, I was pleased with how things panned out.

I approached a seated three set, with a really basic and simple question - "where's good to go on a Tuesday night". Nothing too complicated! I managed to discuss the relative merits of various venues for a few minutes and then promptly ejected. I was chuffed with this, because I had previously only 'opened' a single girl waiting at the bar and I felt my body language was congruent during the interaction. I tried to engage all of the girls who I was talking to, and was quite smiley and it just seemed alright. I was happy with the vibe - nothing contrived or weird about it. It made me think - this ain't so bad after all.

I found another single girl by the bar in Hannah's later on (I prey on them... they're easy for newbies like myself) and used a situational opener, much like the one that CO used on the 4 set. "Hey how's it going, did you see all those people wearing suits and tuxes earlier - what was all that about?". Didn't get much of a response but it was another random I went and spoke to, which is something I never normally do. Challenging my reality, one (baby)step at a time. I could have done a bit better with this one, she misheard me at first and I instinctively leaned in to repeat myself. I need to work on my projection a bit.

The highlight of the night for me was when CO opened the 4 set and I winged. Well, I say winged, I just went over there and isolated one of them, but it seemed like CO had kind of isolated his target so it was alright (the other 2 from the set seemed to be conversing amongst themselves). I had never winged before, and I don't know how I would go about winging for my buddy if he had opened a large set and I had to remove a number of girls to leave him alone with his target. If that makes sense.

Anyway, I had a really good yap with the girl from the 4 set. I had also had a really good chat with a non-approached girl the week before too (another kind-of winged situation), and this was heartening. There is nothing overly defective with my conversational abilities, I thought I was getting IOIs on both occasions. I felt I could have number closed the girl from the 4 set. She seemed disappointed when her friends told her it was time to go. I can move on to that in coming weeks.

All these concepts like kino, disqualifying, value demonstration, etc were just not on my radar last night. It was all about the approach. CO and I had some really constructive chats about opening and how we wanted our openings to be congruent with our general game approach. We don't like the idea of becoming too reliant on opinion openers, as it seems weird to try and transition from that point. I was really taken with Juggler's concept of the 'Floppsy' - i.e. using a situational pivot if you will to initiate an approach. Obviously you have to get that pivot in the first place, but I reckon there are things happening around us all the time that we just don't notice, ripe for using in this context. I'm going to try and improve my social acuity so I notice these things more and, most importantly, act on them.

Couple of examples. At one point we were in Hannah's and this girl approached the bar in what can only be described as a 'cantering' fashion right in front of us. That just seemed ripe for a comment. Then later in another place, one of the girls of a 2 set waiting at the bar managed to eject the contents of her bag all over the floor. Just a cheeky remark said with a smile could initiate a natural and humorous approach.

This is turning into a bit of a ramble, so I will draw things to a close, but CO and I are hopefully going to go out fairly regularly and keep plugging away at this. It was really good and I would recommend anyone out there who is reading loads of material but short on in-field experience to get involved. It helps to have a really good buddy - if it wasn't for CO I would still be nowhere - so cheers mate

Objectives before night:

1. Approach more randoms, specifically an actual set comprising more than one female.
2. Not look like a total dick. Awareness of body language, voice projection and intonation etc.

Positives:

1. Felt that I met my objectives.
2. Really good chat with last girl in Hannah's.
3. First time winging, seemed to go fine.
4. I enjoyed it. I don't want sarging to be a chore, and it genuinely wasn't. Again, credit must go to CO for this.

Negatives

1. I feel that, with hindsight, I could have opened more.
2. CO on a couple of occasions (as he mentioned in his FR) went up to two sets as we were wandering around different locations. During these interactions I did not know what to say or how to contribute.

Objectives to take forward:

1. More approaches. Next time I go out I want to speak to at least 5 different girls, with at least 3 of them being in sets before my approach.
2. Attempt to transition from whatever opening I use to a wider conversation.
3. Following on from 2... if I can transition and start a decent chat, I want to go kino, even if it's only a little!

Blimey that was a lot longer than I envisaged at the start. I don't expect all of my FRs will be so... verbose!

Cheers for reading.

Good FR man! You made progress last night, and every night you come away having made some progress, achieved your goals, and done things you haven't done before - well that's a pretty successful night to me! Keep progressing.

RE: What to do with sets stopped whilst moving - I think just come into the set as well. There will be fewer of these on some nights, as bars will be fuller than they were last night and normal winging procedures will apply. We did it more out of necessity last night than anything else. But if one person stops a passing two set, its perfectly normal for the wing to stand there as well for 30 seconds as part of the group. Perhaps if the wing makes sure they say something as part of the group early on as well, to define themselves as a participant as opposed to an observer, and then they can find an excuse to break off with the obstacle after whoever opens the set has focussed on the target.

Although that's an amateur attempt, I'm sure there are people here who will offer much more thoughtful ideas!

One thing I think is worth adding - it was just generally an enjoyable night last night! We didn't stand around the place hawkishly spying out sets to open. We spent much of the time gabbing about various things, and not really taking much notice of girls around us - for example in Baa Bar when we got chatting about NLP. We were there on our own terms - not other people's. This felt to me like it was significant.

Anyway, a good night man! Onwards!

I'm not sure what sparked me to add this this post but you and I seem to be at the same point of the journey Relentless.

As with you, all I care about is approach. I suffer from a high amount of AA at the start of the night and this is something I'm really working on.

From my point of view, approaching is a little journey. Within those 30 seconds you have to with a massive amount of emotions and anxiety. Also, your brain is in overdrive! The 'Thoughts-per-minute' gauge goes through the roof! i.e. '"Right I'm going to approach", "God! what's stopping me from approaching", "okay! okay! think 3-second rule ... Go!", "Man I hope I don't funk this up", "Which one should I speak to first!", "What am I going to say?", "God! I bet they can sense me walking up to them", "SHIT, they've noticed me... Quick! say something... argh!"

Me: "Hello!..."

All that to say funking HELLO!

But I'm slowly working up a plan to help me build up my confidence and increase my social value (talking to loads of people).

So from what I've worked out, there are 3 kinds of opening. Each with a different difficulty level!

1. The obvious 'see a set, then move to them' - I find this one the hardest at the moment. I get increasingly subconscious as I stroll up to the group and go 'Hey.. blah yak blah'. Rejection usually means you have to move on off... which is highly visible - you can usually spot a guy getting blow out from a 100 meters away! That little 'journey' makes these approaches hard for someone with AA.

2. The situational (usually none moving) - at the bar, girl spills content of her bag, girl waiting outside of the toilet; Easier than approaching. Your both are in each others proximity for a short period of time. You usually don't have to move and usually just have to get her attention to open. But this type of open requires you to think on your feet (usually against a time limit) and to say something half decent to get her attention.

3. The walk-by's - This technique I used when I was feeling a load of AA or the feel like the club is too busy to move. I have girls approach me! I stand in a position where people are walking by. I just stand there and for every girl that walks past I say "Hello, how do doing?" (not in a Joey fashion!) - I don't have to think... I just speak! AA doesn't come into play cos all I'm doing is saying hi! And taking advantage of any interest I get to open up more. Right, so, uuuuussuualllly you're not going to pick up hot girls like this but you're most likely pick up the friendly ones! Also rejections are relatively undetectable. There's a BIG rejection difference from walking up to a 3 set, getting blown out and having to walk way than just saying hello to someone and getting at the very least a pleasant smile back. This is the way I opened up the 2 set that helped CO (or is it OO now?) a k-close on Sat.

So thats what I do to build myself up.

I can't remember who said it to me on Saturday night in Manchester but they mentioned Social Momentum; I'm starting off small... then work my way up to the harder approaches.

K - externally, you're right! But internally, I am! Most people plagued with AA replay that rejection over and over in their heads. (I know I do! - something that will change with practice, I'm sure!)

AA is an internal process and 80% of the battle not being bullied by our own emotions. Though people aren't watching you, it sure feels like they are! A feeling probably intrinsically linked to the emotion of rejection / embarassment.

Have you ever played Advance Guess Who...? Each player has two cards! Looooads harder! Haha!

Wow what an awesome load of responses from my first FR – thanks to you all.

CO:

This is what I want to do, without it messing up the dynamic. I'm conscious of not only fucking things up for myself, but my wing too. Tell you what, next time I will go with the philosophy 'say anything', and we'll see what happens. It will either work or we'll have something to laugh about over a brew at the end of the night!

You said CO that you were annoyed at leaving that 2 set in Flute. I reckon that had I managed to engage in some way, it would have made it easier. You were probably (on some level) conscious of me stood there as just an observer and it increased your 'ejection propensity' (haha - can I coin that one).

On further reflection, I think the reason I didn't interject during your chat with that set (sixth formers ) is because I didn't understand their response to your question about the tux people. But then after we left I realised that neither did you - we were like 'speech award ceremony' wtf is that?... We could have just pressed for more information and seen where it took us. And as we were saying - plenty of scope for cheeky banter there.

Absolutely. This only served to put me in a better state to talk to people generally. And that could be a perfect trigger for an opener...

"Hey, my friend and I are chatting about NLP and how much you can read into people's body language. We're sceptical but we find it interesting. What do you reckon? Do you want to try a little experiment with us?"

Could work. I mean, we were flowing when we talking about that stuff, so it would be totally congruent. Dunno... it's like a spur of the moment opinion opener.

Indeed. I'll speak to you tomorrow fella.

K:

I have been influenced by other information sources. One of the mantras is never to give away power, never lean in, let her lean in instead. The thing is, if I just give my elocution a bit of thought, I project just fine most of the time. I sometimes have a tendency to speak quite quickly. Basically, I think I could improve this to some degree, but, as you point out, I shouldn't attach so much significance to this.

Great examples. I wonder if I could say things like that on the spot though. I guess if I was totally relaxed and not 'within my own head' then I probably could come up with material of similar quality. I thought the same thing when I was reading more Juggler the other day. He gives accounts of saying things which really work, right on the spot. Perhaps improv games and stuff could help here. I think... no I know I can say funny/cheeky stuff on cue - it's just the frequency with which it comes to me.

Authenticity is what I am striving for. Kind of relates to that other great post doing the rounds at the moment about honesty and not giving a fuck. I dig Tyler's take on this. I shouldn't have to think about it either. As you say, it should be unconscious.

I hear you. I'll prioritise this.

Hehe, thanks for distilling everything for me. I need that sometimes. I can ramble like the best of em

MB:

Dude I'm glad something sparked you to contribute because if we're around the same level then hopefully we can bounce stuff off each other and help each other out. Are you in the Manchester 'collective'? I want to come up next time with CO so it would be good to meet you and everyone else.

Yep, I'm totally the same at the moment. My inner monologue goes into overdrive and I regress into my head. The more you think, the harder it gets. I like Tolle on emptying your head and letting your brain be your servant rather than your master. I think being more present and in the 'now' could help with this.

Above all else - trust yourself. I wonder if the reason we internalise all those thoughts you listed is because we think that we have to think about the approach before we approach. You run through what you're going to say. You pre-suppose their response. You pre-pre-suppose your response to their response. Why do this? Ok have an idea of what your opener is loosely going to be about before you go up perhaps, but leave it at that. And go with the flow. So easy for me to sit here and type this, I wonder if I could take my own suggestion on board... possibly not! But yea, my point is that I think we fool ourselves into thinking we need to deconstruct the approach before it even happens. If you're in a good place mentally then the approach would take care of itself?

Regarding the rejection stuff, I don't know how I feel about that yet to be honest. If my purpose is purely to open my mouth and utter recognisable sounds at people I don't know, then it's never a rejection. Of course when I progress and start going for more in my interactions then fear of rejection may become an issue.

Are you worried about asking for a number or going in for a kiss and getting blown out? I wonder if perhaps we may be able to gauge from the interaction generally whether a number/snog would be forthcoming anyway?

Thanks again guys. A lot here for me to digest, but as K suggested, I should worry about certain things less. Thanks for that link to the spotlight effect dude.

You're a sick mother lover! Mental Guess Who Kung Fu!

And re the Spotlight affect and other link, I'll have a butchers.

So here's a question for you. There are many theories about raising Social Proof by being in a group of Women laughing and joking or walking in with two beautiful women, smiling as you walk in to a club, etc. If the Spotlight affect comes into play and no one is looking, all those things don't matter too right?

Or have I missed the point?

Good first field report Relentless. From the sounds of it, you did everything right - plenty of approaches, not caring too much about where they went or what other people thought of you and blowing your AA into next week.

I'd try not to think of things as "negative points", more as learning experiences. You'll find that with every night of going out you'll have plenty to improve on and you'll subconsciously improve these areas in all aspects of social interaction, not just meeting women on nights out. Certainly, I wouldn't worry about using too many canned openers and material. Like CO said in a recent post (about drumming I seem to recall), when you're finding your feet with this stuff it's useful to have music to read from. With time, practice and patience, you'll learn to improvise without the music (if I may continue this metaphor) and transition into saying what you feel rather than what you've read.

By the way K, thanks for linking me to Swype's post, it's badass. Something I've been thinking about from time to time too. I'd recommend people to read it, so here's the link again:

http://www.puaforum.co.uk/pua-genera...mentality.html

Thanks Blanca. My reasoning when I put those 'negatives' was simply to focus on what I want to do better next time, but you're right I could re-frame that in a more positive light.

I have thought about using opinion openers and canned stuff just while I'm starting out and it didn't sit that well with me. I'm going out tonight so I will see how it pans out. I have a couple of opinion openers ready that I could use if I felt I needed them.

You mean someone actually read all that?! Its buried away in the midst of one of the longest and perhaps most pointless FRs I've written!

Respect man - if you can wade through that bollocks, War And Peace will be a piss take!