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I'm half-tempted to change the title of the thread from "Universally Unattractive Guys" to "Why Jordan Peterson is a Hypocrite" but I'll refrain.

Too bad, I've been binging on his videos as of late. Though more recently on theory of mind rather than gender dynamics.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Isildur1 (Post 130414)

I found it pretty disappointing that he encourages anti depressant use those things can be extremely damaging long term I think it’s much better to use diet , exercise and sleep first and foremost

Counselling works too.

Wonder what Jordan says to his clients who are struggling with women though.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Isildur1 (Post 130433)

Think having a strong team around you can be effective counselling. Most men are pretty isolated and unable to express themselves properly because they have no real male role models or don’t know how to build proper social circles.

Yes, especially higher value social circles. When I think of a high value social circle though, I don't necessarily mean one where there are loads of girls in it, but at a minimum guys who are helpful with jobs & realistic ambitions, and not deadbeat losers. Time after time, the guys who struggle the most I've noted, tend to hang out with the same kinds of guys rather than reaching out for help. They then wonder why they're depressed & feeling lonely much of the time.

Though, admittedly these guys are in a rut and so have to make the effort to break thru first, which ain't easy when they don't know where to start.

Z

Quote:

Originally Posted by Isildur1 (Post 130457)

Yeah , i understand. This is part of the reason why Im against coaching in alot of regards when someone is " in too deep" with problems a 2 day bootcamp or even 10 day "immersion" isnt going to fix long standing issues at all .

I'm tempted to take a boot camp with a coach myself once the risk of getting fined/whatever for covid disappears (I hardly care at all about the disease itself). However, I would take one with the expectation that it would not change a lot, but more as an experience to add to my life, and as a minor enhancement to skill.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Isildur1 (Post 130457)

This shit takes time to develop , making real friends, building value its a 10-20 year process which takes time to do. Young men 18-22 havent really seen the world properly so its difficult for them to provide adequate conversation to hook girls.

Assuming that is, you're relying on conversation. In nightclubs and where alcohol is often involved, it's more about appearance/style and vibe lol

Quote:

Originally Posted by Isildur1 (Post 130457)

Social circles can bring out the best in you or reinforce bad habits its important to pick your friends wisely.

With regards to a skill you wanna improve, yup. I do wonder about having one social circle for game, and another for other stuff, like music, where it doesn't matter who you hang with (even if half of them were social outcasts or losers, yet are awesome musicians).

Z

There was a TV programme about such universally unattractive guys way back in 2006. It was called Seduction School and featured the pick up artist training group Charisma Arts. Back in April 2007 someone post me this video on a none pua forum just a community forum called themoononline | Home after I complained about my lack of success with women: https://youtu.be/a51DipqHFeo

Curiously they charge about £2000 for a 2 day "camp" :

https://www.charismaarts.com/convers...versation-camp

Given my argument about "boot camps" where if you want to get good at something it takes ~21 days to learn a new habit, it's probably a waste of money.

I totally agree that Charisma Arts are a total rip off. And they dont even have female instructors either as I think you can learn far more from female instructors. You are also not going to be able to learn that much in just two days of training. As I think that it takes at least a few weeks to get good with women. You would be far better off watching a couple of dozens YouTube pick up example videos than enrolling on a bootcamp.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr_Zed (Post 129951)

Hi all,

This thread addresses guys who approach loads (like 1000 sets or more a year) and get basically nowhere. No action, no dates, or sometimes even no contact details (though the 3 of these have fundamentally different reasons why). In the realms of cold approach, most guys start to see results steadily improve on a month by month basis. Tom Torero claimed in his "Beginners Guide to DayGame" that it take around 2 years to get consistent action.

A lot of pickup advice out there has focused on "techniques" whilst having a socially appealing lifestyle yet doing both cold and warm approaches. However, a lot of it fails to address a big thing - the guys out there, who are not considered "normal." Autism, chronically anxious guys, low social awareness, men who cannot make friends etc. You only have to look at cases like First Person Approacher and Dan Cilley who have published their persistently low par results, to see that guys like that need long term coaching.

In fact, the best advice I've lately seen is removing eccentric traits, rather than focusing on techniques. In many ways, game is more about removing things you do wrong, than getting things right.

Thoughts?

Z

long term coaching is not practical. most guys who enter the pick up scene usually do so later in life, after failing at being themselves. another thing is, the older you are, the harder it is for you to change. so if youre 30, it's pretty much too late for most. your reproductive years are also very limited, so by the time you figure it all out, you're already out of the dating market. if you look at the vast majority of couples, their age is actually similar. so let's say the 30yr old pua has long term coaching. he finally figures it out by 40. by this time, he doesnt have much to choose from. much like the guy who enters a bufet at 1:30pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr_Zed (Post 130447)

i actually know a guy who only befriends men from self help groups such as autism. he goes to college, works out at a gym, and works at amazon, but has 0 friends from none.
https://s3.amazonaws.com/gag.draft.i...965d36580b.jpg