Hello

I am new to online dating. I gotta tell you, online datings sites seriously p*ss me off.

1. There are so many of dating sites to choose from.

2. But they are all heaving with terrible photos of insanely ugly women

3. And the good looking women normally scams. Either that or they are disused account and or never reply.

4. When you create a profile you get an avalanche of emails from women but most of them:
a) haven't even visited your profile
b) and are from un-active accounts
c) and/or don't even have photos

5. And they are so bl**dy expensive - you can't possibly pay for them them all!

6. But you can't read any emails unless you pay!

Look, I don't want to pay good money just to read emails from scams, robots and ugly women with terrible photos!

And it all takes so much precious TIME.

But then I persist and finally I find and 'Like' and/or favourite a few reasonably attractive woman.

I take a little trouble to see what these ladies are interested. I send them some nicely crafted messages. And now I have emails back from them... Whoopee!

So like a mug, I pay up to read them. And guess what - they are all auto responses. Not a single one of the women has even read any of my messages?

What is this? Every single site wants to charge what, £20 or £30 a month?

Any yet porn is free - WTF?!

Look I don't mind paying. I'd be delighted to pay but only once I know I'm not being ripped the f*** off!

What am I missing?

J

Whenever I can find them. Now that I think about it it's the finding of them that's largest sticking point.

I live in a small city and given my age (v late 40s), finding even remotely age-appropriate (c.32-42?) single women seems to be harder these days.
Younger than that frankly, I just don't find them to be mentally interesting. They might be fine for a quick shag I suppose, but I don't just want a quick shag with a flighty, frivolous, vacuous air-head... time is running out and I want a meaningful relationship. I sometimes approach young hotties just for the practice, but I don't have an agenda.

But meetups, parties, weddings, dinner parties.... sure, I'll approach anyone, no problem.

Back to dating sites, they strike me as a waste of both money and time - huge amounts time.
I'm probably just not photogenic enough, but either way I get a lot more traction with ladies in the real world.

J

A lot of sites send you automated emails that look like from members but really they are not. You can spot them a mile off because they all say something quite generic or it just sounds really fake, some of them will also come from women who live literally hundreds of miles away (which could be real, but generally is a bit fishy). They do this so that you'll sign up & pay for their site.

Kowalski is right - Tinder & POF are free but from friends I've heard POF is pretty shite. Most women I know on it get bombarded with guys that message them with stuff like "Fancy a fuck?" etc & it puts them off straight away. Also understand that online dating is predominantly a womans market; the ratio of men VS women on these sites is always higher & given that women get hammered with messages all the time they have to filter tem down to a select few which makes "competing" (only work I can think of) for these women pretty difficult. This sounds materialistic & contraversial, but if your not good looking guy - you may find it a bit of a struggle (purely based on the volume of available men & the amount of messages women get); even average guys struggle with it.

Match & e-Harmony are 2 of the top sites, but you do have to pay for them. Or you can just use Tinder and just swipe yes to everyone like Kowalski says without even looking at your phone, then filter out when youhave matches as neccessary.

Why do you think he wants a relationship out of fear?

I could give you large number of reasons why I want a relationship I don't see fear being anywhere close to being on the radar screen.

Any views on Craig's List?

Most of the original gripes you're talking about generally revolve around paid sites. Never been on POF much but I've used Tinder and OkCupid before with a lot of success. The key to outbalancing the men sending tons of creepy messages is:

1. Sort out your profile and pics. Not as much to seem as good looking as possible, but so you look approachable, fun and clearly some long fingernailed seat sniffing weirdo.

2. Message a bunch of girls with some simple ass shit. Overthinking is a waste of time. I was using tinder with a ot of success a while back and my opening message was always something like 'Hey', 'Pint?' or a combination of the two. Again, fuss free, and clearly not some mentaloid.

3. Go the fuck out a lot. This shit can work really well, but it's always secondary to going out and being a real human being.

A lot of this shit seems to be excuses and roadblocks you're throwing in the way of yourself, which can just be avoided by either ignoring them or doing something else. I found the thing about not approaching girls in their 20s odd. SUre there are dumb girls in their 20s, but I've been with mature, chill, smart as fuck girls in their 20s and girls in their mid to late 30s who are immature, clingy ass mindjobs.

Go out first, the online dating shit is ancillary.
Incidentally, how often do you game?

Also a link to a profile or any of the shit you're sending out might be enlightening

So maybe you're right, maybe hitting on hot girls in their 20s is OK for a guy who is twice their age so long as I keep it light/fun. TBH nowadays when I look at a girl in her 20s and think "she's just a child", nonetheless it's good practice after all.

I had a fantastic evening tonight via meetup.com and was quietly practicing some stuff on a couple of girls in the group. But it's a bit like shooting rats in a barrel compared to sharking on one's own in bars / in a night club.

I'm out every other night, but being a coward, I tend to have a pretext of some sort e.g. a group of friends/ a meetup group.

TBH, I'm still rebuilding my confidence and I have yet to decide whether I can be bothered to take the pain of actually sharking in bars on my own. I mean a guy who is 50ish sharking on his own? It's not a great look and for that reason it sure takes balls!

Why do I want to be in a relationship? Sure:

To me each relationship is a unique dance between two unique people. It is almost entirely impossible to predict or determine how things will pan out. One can't change someone else, but one can bring out the best sides in them. And with luck they may even do the same for you.

All one can do is be open to possibilities.

So in NO particular order, and with much overlap here goes:

- to give powerful love to one person
- to receive love from one person
- to have more love & compassion echoing out into my life to offer to friends, to family maybe even to strangers, who knows - possibly to the whole world.
- the experience the intense pleasure of sexual gratification
- to have less shallow relationships in my social live (no longer swung into stuf because I am single)
- To gain a sense of closeness & intimacy (both physical & emotional)
- Humour/entertainment
- To gain a sense of giving
- To go on a journey of self-discovery
- To go on a journey of deeply understanding another human being
- Having more energy in my live and having more to give the world
- Emotional/psychological/spiritual development
- A feeling of being of use
- Avoidance of loneliness
- To help someone through the tricky steps of life with occasional insights and wisdom, particularly when you have already trod certain tricky hand-holds on the face of the mountain (as it were)
- With luck to maybe receive something similar back
- To facilitate someone else to flourish and more fully become themselves
- To be able to make a bigger impact on life through greater energy, greater support, greater wisdom
- A greater sense of security, of meaning and of purpose
- To feel that one is making the most of this short life
- To save money and live more cheaply
- An expression of passion, romance, life and love
- Have someone to warm the bed for you or for her
- An emotional journey and adventure
- A solution to the drinking and driving problem (every other time!)
- Supporting, validating, caring for someone else
- And maybe getting some of the same back... or not. I don't necessarily care.
- To step into someone else's entire universe, which is different from mine.
- To get to know new people
- To have a soulmate to go on a journey to try to deeply understand what the underlying issues are of how things work
- To spark ideas, insights & wisdom off each other
- To have a partner to bounce one's sometimes crazy ideas off and find out which are how crazy and to stop you making some stupid mistakes
- Possibly to have children, possibly not

... I am open to all these possibilities and none of them, but if nothing else I would hope:

- To spend the rest of my life with someone in whose company I like myself better.


OK kowalski, your turn, buster

J

That sounds like a cowardly response, peaceful warrior. What are YOUR reasons for wanting to be in a relationship? Answer your own question.

Ain't a thing wrong with meetups and shit like that. My point is that real life trumps online shit. It's a more direct way to go about it and the only way you'll get more attuned socially. Oddly enough, and for quite a few reasons, you'll find going out and gaming in real life more will make the online shit a lot easier.

Everyone's got some shit dude, it's all a matter of just getting used to it regardless. You're also not helping yourself at all by framing it as 'sharking'. There's nothing predatory about going up to people in bars and talking to them. Heaven forfend, you might have a conversation or something.

Oh, and also,

Ignore this dude ship69. He's either mental or the biggest troll on here. As far as anyone on here can discern he's never even been with a girl and he's certainly in no position to give advice on anything game related.

Listen man, you miss my tone! Maybe it's an Atlantic-crossing thing, but I am much more tongue in cheek than you are giving me credit for. I was simply challenging you, not being angry with you.

Yes, I am aware I do have a lot to learn from around here (if you read my threads carefully this will be apparent). But I pick and choose my influencers.

I am on a different path from you that's all.

I was reflecting on it this morning on a run. If nothing else one needs to get clear about what it is that I really want. Me, I've had it with being single. And do I want fuck lots of different women? Actually, honestly, no I don't. Heresy around these parts I know, but too bad.

I know this probably sounds weird to you but what I actually want is to be in a meaningful relationship.

What has come to light lately is that my 'game' is so diabolical that I have recently blown it with a girl who was very close to being my ideal women. In hindsight, it was almost textbook how not to do it 'weakness'.

And I have accepted that my footsteps were so catastrophically bad that I'll never get her now and that I need to cut my losses, cut off all contact and cold turkey to get her out of my system.

So why am I on this forum ? I am here to learn and improve my game dramatically. I may or may not wind up fucking lots of women on my journey. Yes, it might happen and it might be a fun diversion for a while. Whatever happens I know a number of guys who are addicted to new conquests and it doesn't lead to happiness. And if and when one wants to stick with one lady that suddenly becomes extremely hard.

I don't really care either way about fucking a large number of women. It just doesn't really matter... but I am intensely aware that I do need to build my gaming skillset so that I can choose and land a really high quality lady. What happened recently to me must never happen again, ever.

So that's it. You don't want to be in a relationship. I do. You may think that not wanting to fuck as many women as one possibly can before you die is "cowardly".

No offence - honestly! - but in truth it is your position that I call cowardly.

Getting bored now.

Peace

J