but i wont at a bootcamp! these guys are trying to spout u shit about tricks & tips and magic words & its all bollocks.

RIGHT THATS IT!!!!!!!!

IM DOING A WEBSITE, IM DOING A PROPER COURSE ON SOCIAL SKILL & Just being generally awesome. im doin it this week!

proper annoys me how guys are spending money on that shit which i know isnt working.

its basically a form of bullying. and ill be doin a money back guarantee as well!

Phil I think you generalize when you say it isn't working.

I agree that PUA does take advantage of lonely or socially awkward men by over charging, over promising then under-delivering but at the same time to say it isn't working or doesn't work isn't entirely true.

I think 1 of the reason it works with guys who live in fear of approaching girls is because they attend this bootcamp where they are forced to be social with the other guys then girls and are forced to approach girls.

Essentially its a game of numbers, before they attend the bootcamp they have approached 0 girls
At the bootcamp they approach maybe 40 girls

even if they have a 10% success rate, thats a 400% increase on what they were getting before, however the pua "trainer" will put it down to being and awesome guru, wheareas in reality the guy may have learned a few tips on the course but the face that they have been forced to go out and make that first giant leap overcoming their anxiety/nerves.

I am however intrigued in your website Phil and the moment I have a spare £1000 I shall book myself in!

I guess that's true, but the problem have with this is that going out for a weekend with someone where the only major benefit is that you were forced to approach a lot is not worth $1800. Hell I could force people to approach all weekend, and all I'd ask for is for them to buy me beer.

The problem I have with bootcamps is the way they're marketed in general. They sell it as a LIFE CHANGING EARTH SHATTERING EXPERIENCE, as if you'll go in a basement dweller, hang around with some guy in a funny hat for 3 nights and come out as a stone cold pimp. That idea doesn't stand up to even a few minutes of honest scrutiny.
Life doesn't work that way. If you have no game and can't approach or interact well then sorting that takes TIME and WORK, you can't just throw money at the dude from VH1 and expect a massive difference overnight.

Aside from that all the information you will get from a bootcamp (especially with old school MM guys like Arash and Matador) is readily available online for free. I took a glance at Arash's website and it looks like he's still using that A3-C1-C2 etc timeline thing. That thing's a cumbersome waste of time anyway, most guys end up trying to get that sort of complex tactical stuff OUT of their heads.

So like I say, don't expect magic with anyone, if you were really set on doing a bootcamp I wouldn't do it with them. There are much better guys out there who'll charge less and won't clutter your head up with irrelevant schtick.

I wouldn't pay £1800 for it either (plus flights & hotel etc.) and I don't think many people with an avergage IQ and earning an average wage would, but different people see value in different things

However if you are late 30s, you haven't had a date in nearly a decade and barely ever talk to girls let alone ring or touch them, 4 numbers and peck on the cheek would be a pretty awesome experience. Thats how they get the good reviews...

Rollindeep. I was in the same situation as you when I started out, well maybe not the same situation but what i'm getting at is I was taken in by Matador, Style, Mystery etc and just thought they were the shit. The truth is: they're not the shit. Save your money. Start the slow, tedious but fun process of going out a lot and trial and error. Also i like rsd stuff, if you get a chance watch some of their vids on rsdfreetour (youtube) or rsdtyler (youtube).

Have fun buddy.

Affordable? Just imagine how many nights out you could go on in a row with that kind of money.

You don't need a sodding bootcamp. At the end of the day you are hoping to come out the other side suddenly fixed and a changed man. Do you seriously that's gonna happen, like really?

You don't suddenly become good at something after 3 days!! You need to work hard and seriously at this shit to get anywhere, like anything.

What's up with you? You're going to buy into the same PU sales bollocks that 90% of 'PUA' on the internet is based on.

Then you're going to get pissed off it isn't working.

Then you're going to work out your hourly wage, divide it by the amount you've spent and then cry deeply at how many hours of your life you've wasted learning the wrong shit.

[quote=Rollindeep;63102].

It looks really affordable at $1800, with not one, but two master puas. However the flight will be expensive...

QUOTE]

often the easy thing to do when we can't see the final solution is to throw money at the problem in the hope it will solve it.

as suggested by everyone else rsd