i just want to say, this is an excellent post!

winging, is a crucial element in gaming, and soemtimes is the difference between riding the HB10 of your dreams, or riding the Vomit Comet back to whence you came...

'Altruism?' or however you spell it, this is absolutely critical! in the past i have trusted people too much and not got anything in return. I now only wing for people who have read the game, or are at least familiar with PU gaming.

A lot of 'wings' are only 'riding' and dont actually put anything back your way, thats something to watch out for! it can be a really frustrating problem, as i have found out before!

a team ethic is hard to establish, and its difficult to find people who go out as a team or group and want not only themselves but the other members of their team to perform well!

good wings are rare!

I know what you mean Picard. I've had the same problems many times in the past.

Interesting point. I have a couple of mates who are bad and good at gaming who haven't read the game and have had mixed results with both of them. The guy who is super confident around girls is appauling at winging, or at least giving value to his friends around girls in a social setting. I recall one time some girl was complimenting my hair, I was chatting to her and after a few moments he decides to wade in and overpowers me and takes over the coversation, in an almost 'let me show you how it's done son' attitude. Value sapping to the max, and all for one hot girl. Another occassion I was chatting to a girl at a party and he saw this, he came past and then slapped me on the arse. Luckily the girl read this perfectly and told me what a dick he was. She knew full well he was trying to undermine my value. I just remained unaffected so no harm done, but the wingmanship was attrocious!

Then there's another mate who has little belief in his own game but when I've been out he's always tried to give value to me when it comes to girls. One time we were in a club and he spotted an asian girl that I might like and before I knew it he got her attention, span her round, introduced me and left us to it. Quality winging.

My point is, it's not necessarily about if someone has read any material, it's about those who are willing to give value and not make themselves look good. Reading material and knowing the rules is a help for sure, but those who are willing to help someone else and who is not affected about building up their own ego is another kettle of fish.

Word bro, word.

actually i think you're right, its not exclusively about haveing read or studied the material.

to me i guess, its a show of dedication perhaps? i've had it out with good m8s who have poorly winged and said to them 'until you read the game and appreciate it, im not going to give you any more assists'

lol, harsh words perhaps? ... at the time i was frustrated as i wasn't getting any.

Now however, i've got myself regular action, which is great, and its given me time and resource to help others who aren't so lucky. I wish more people did that after they'd got their own result.

If a striker scores in a game and wins 1-0, thats good.

If a striker scores, then puts in 2 great crosses for his strike-parter to finish off, he gets man of the match!

Well said Jaz and K. This is massively important and I think some guys choose to ignore this. Those guys are often the selfish value leeching pricks. Busting into another guys opened set uninvited and without helping the guy achieve his target is not running good game, it is lame.

Amen!.. Bro's before Hoe's

Top class thread, essential reading.

A wing has various roles to play. This thread has focussed on the operational 'in-set' functions of a wing, which are all very important. It does strike me that this shit should be the most obvious stuff in the world. A two set with one fit girl and one munter is going to need someone to keep the munter busy while I go in for the fit one.

Unfortunately, my non-PUA friends don't appreciate this, nor the concept of just being a good wing (and actually, for them, of just being a good, non judgemental, selfless friend).

As well as these operational codes, there are broader roles which we all play as wings. Personally I'd like to have a wing in a set with me because, afterwards, I'd like his opinion on what happened. On Friday night, I was out with non-PUA friends of mine. I opened a two set unwinged. They left after a short conversation. My 'mate' Jack's response was to come over and take the piss at my 'failed' attempt to chat up girls.

(The reason he does this is because he can't open girls himself. None of my mates can. And the mutuality of their shortcomings also becomes their validation: Its fine for Jack to be rubbish at opening new girls, because Dom is shit at it as well. And therefore he would rather I didn't try to do it, for if I get good at approaching new girls, it will simply underline his own lacking in this area.)

A good wing, however, would have been there after that set. They might have said 'Your body language wasn't great - your hands were in your pockets for half of it' or 'you sounded a little needy with that line about your Mum' or whatever else. But they would also have said 'Fuck it, it doesn't matter, lets open three more in the next 30 minutes... That blonde girl there, go get her. Go. GO!'

But at bottom, its all about team work. Like everything else, if we work together, we can multiply our levels of success. And like any good team, we win as a team, and we lose as a team. If I'm out and pulling left right and centre, but my wing isn't have such a great night, I will stop and help him out. Only when I am succeeding repeatedly, and my wing is succeeding repeatedly, will I be content.

Tomorrow night I'm off out with Mick the wing from Liverpool - a propper PUA wing who I know has strong views on good winging. It was only thanks to Mick that I did my first real direct approach last week. He did one first, and then said it was my turn to do one. After a little encouragement from him, I did it - and we each shared in that lovely PUA glow of having done something crazy like tell a girl she's pretty!

Now that's good winging!

I should print this thread out and hand a copy to my drinking buddies

my 2 wings are great... and every week we are getting better and better...but we only do this by pushing each other, and I mean physically pushing each other onto sets...

We dont do this "im not in state shit" if one person isnt feeling it... the other will make sure he opens a set to get him in state... "come on for fuck sake, do it man" followed by a push normally does it.

Ive also found going out in 2's is tricky as when one person opens a set the other stands around like clicky the cunt, on his own.

Going out in groups of 3's is cool, when one opens the other 2 can observe and come in when necessary, we have a thing where, the person inset will if he needs help with very subtly put his hand in his back pocket for 2 seconds or put one hand behind his back for 2 seconds... thats the quewe to go in and help.

The only thing I would say can be an issue... (and we had it last Saturday night)..is when you have a destroying bad night...last Saturday we where knackered from the epic friday night, one of the guys had an eye infection and the other just hates a certain bar/club we frequent

I was Mr Aggresive, and spent the night shouting at the other 2 to get their act together... unfortunatley to no avial... We ended up leaving at 1am... it was a rotten night.... but things can only get better, they couldnt get worse than last saturday