I disagree Ali. For a start, there's no way I'd lie to get a girl into bed. I don't doubt that it works and brings you a lot of success, but it is decidedly uncool. Why should I lie? I have nothing about myself to be ashamed of, and if a girl doesn't go for it then it's her loss.

Secondly, lowering her value in order to make yourself seem cooler? There's another word for this - bullying.

Thirdly, correct me if I'm wrong but you seem to be advocating getting a girl to cheat on her boyfriend. Admittedly, at times like those I've described, it's awfully tempting, but I refuse to do it. I've never had a girl cheat on me (at least, not one I was ever bothered about), but I know if a girl I'd really liked had cheated on me, I'd have been devastated. Could you do that to an innocent guy just for a quick shag? Quite.

Rather, I prefer to just be authentic. To be myself and give value rather than take it. If I go up with the "full cup" and start spreading the love, I'm in a far better position than someone sucking up the value in the interaction. I did used to be into the Mystery Method stuff. It got me some successes and it seemed like a cool way to do things, but gradually I adapted the natural, authentic way of doing things and I think it's much better. Yes it takes longer to learn and get good at, but all the best things do. Anything that's worth doing is worth taking a long time to learn. Like learning the guitar, or ju-jitsu.

Whatever

What? Don't want get off on the wrong foot but I couldn't be bothered to reply to blanca's bullocks

for the record, I also believe in being as genuine as poss but sometimes u do hav to tell White lies and it def isn't bullying, I mean WTF

Wow! Heated! Personally I don't lie in anyway even white lies.

I'm in the quandry over lowering someones value... What's a neg if not an attempt to lower someones value? Even the playful ones...

How do you roll with her?
She just poops words!
Nice outfit, but hate your shoes!
etc

Fun, playful... But still an attempt to gain a sort of power over them on a very minimum level.

I don't (initially - unless I fuck up) go for big negs... 1) cos they don't work - ie Huslter saw me bomb big style on our first approach in Gloucester after I attempted a big neg 2) I don't want to make people feel like shit.

I'm still deciding where the line is drawn but I think lowering peoples value beyond a playful intent is wrong.

P.s. Ali... 'Whatever' comments won't win you any favours here... If you strongly disagree then put you thoughts down. Me, personally after meeting you would really like to hear your argues for using LV techniques. I believe, in PU, there is no right or wrong way. But everyones intent SHOULD be to feel good and make others feel good. Any technique that doesn't or degrades someones worth should be tossed out and replaced with something else.

This is a forum... It's great to have different opinions on it, otherwise it goes against the spirit of the word.

I have to say I am a fan of negging/teasing/banter (which in my mind are pretty much all the same). It's something I enjoy doing with a woman and I think it makes the interaction more playful and fun. Though the way I neg and how much I do it depends on the woman's personality i.e. how much banter/teasing I think she can take and what I can get away with. But I'm always careful, I keep my negs fairly light because the last thing I want to do it is upset the woman or make her feel uncomfortable. I don't subscribe to the notion of lowering a woman's value in order to get with her.

From my personal experience, I find that negging is a good way to disarm a woman's defences, or bitch shield. For instance, I approached a 3 set on a night out a couple of weeks ago. They're weren't that pretty, I just approached them to warm up and have a laugh with them. One of them (the prettier one of the 3) was being a little less friendly than the other two (she told me to fuck off in Welsh, which was the only thing she could say in Welsh). So I turned to her nicer friend and said "Is she always like this?" then turned to the prettier one and said "I prefer your friend, she's far nicer!". Her attitude changed completely, she replied with "yeah, I know, she is" and she was far more friendly and open. Any thoughts on this?

Yeah fair enough MB, the "whatever" was a bit wanky

negs and lowering ppls values only works on very specfic ppl, HB8-10 will deal with well, if done correctly, but if u do this to an average to good looking person it will not go down well

also when u neg u must be smiling, and say something nice after

it is teasing but the aim is to raise your value not make them feel like total shit

I don't often do it, as there aren't many ppl in Bristol who are stunning enough to do it to but it def works

'Oi, shut your mouth and let your other lips do the moaning'. Fun Neg for when a girl is kicking off at you.

I like "your so bad at being pretty"

That sounds more like flirting than negging, although I'd probably say it in a way that conveys interest as opposed to a put down. In that sense I can't imagine any girl would find that value lowering... and that's a good thing.

Flirting should be enjoyable for both, not scratching around in a desperate bid to raise one's own value.

definetly agree with that blanca, i used to visit a mate at his halls when he went to chichester uni and every girl he introduced me to had a boyfriend, i only met one girl that was single and that was something to do with the fact she was a hb2, not even worth a handjob. I didnt even attempt any bf killer with any of them and proceeded to get smashed as i heard all about where this girl's boyfriend was taking her in the summer! uk girls need to adopt the yanks approach to college