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Darood · **What Everyone New to PUA Should Know -** 19-06-2012, 08:59 PM

This is a fantastic bit of dialouge from Atlas Shrugged by Ayn Rand. Everyone starting off in the game needs to read this, it will save you alot of wasted effort chasing tail.

Quote:

“Do you remember what I said about money and about the men who seek to reverse the law of cause and effect? The men who try to replace the mind by seizing the products of the mind? Well, the man who despises himself tries to gain self- esteem from sexual adventures–which can’t be done, because sex is not the cause, but an effect and an expression of a man’s sense of his own value.”

“You’d better explain that.”

“Did it ever occur to you that it’s the same issue? The men who think that wealth comes from the material resources and has no intellectual root or meaning, are the men who think–for the same reason–that sex is a physical capacity which functions independently of ones mind, choice or code of values. They think that your body creates a desire and makes a choice for you just about in some such way as if iron ore transformed itself into railroad rails of its own volition. Love is blind, they say; sex is impervious to reason and mocks the power of all philosophers. But, in fact, a man’s sexual choice is the result and the sum of his fundamental convictions. Tell me what a man finds sexually attractive and I will tell you his entire philosophy on life. Show me the woman he sleeps with and I will tell you his valuation of himself. No matter what corruption he’s taught about the virtue of selflessness, sex is the most profoundly selfish of all acts, an act which he cannot perform for any motive but his own enjoyment–just try to think of performing it in a spirit of selfless charity!–an act which is not possible in self-abasement, only in self-exaltation, only in confidence of being desired and being worthy of desire. It is an act that forces him to stand naked in spirit, as well as in body, and to accept his real ego as his standard of value. He will always be attracted to the woman who reflects his deepest vision of himself, the woman whose surrender permits him to experience–or to fake–a sense of self-esteem. The man who is proudly certain of his own value, will want the highest type of woman he can find, the woman he admires, the strongest, the hardest to conquer — because only the possession of a heroine will give him the sense of an achievement, not the possession of a brainless slut. He does not seek to . . . what’s the matter?” he asked, seeing the look on Rearden’s face, a look of intensity much beyond mere interest in an abstract discussion.

“He does not seek to gain his value, he seeks to express it. There is no conflict between the standards of his mind and the desires of his body. But the man who is convinced of his own worthlessness will be drawn to a woman he despises–because she will reflect his own secret self, she will release him from that objective reality in which he is a fraud, she will give him a momentary illusion of his own value and a momentary escape from the morel code that damns him. Observe the ugly mess which most men make of their sex lives–and observe the mess of contradictions which they hold as their moral philosophy. One proceeds from the other. Love is our response to our highest values–and can be nothing else. Let a man corrupt his values and his view of existence, let him profess that love is not self-enjoyment but self-denial, that virtue consists, not of pride, but of pity or pain or weakness or sacrifice, that the noblest love is born, not of admiration, but of charity, not in response to values, but in response to flaws–and he will have cut himself in two. His body will not obey him, it will not respond, it will make him impotent toward the woman he professes to love and draw him to the lowest type of whore he can find. His body will always follow the ultimate logic of his deepest convictions; if he believes that flaws are values, he has damned existence as evil and only the evil will attract him. He has damned himself and he will feel that depravity is all he is worthy of enjoying. He has equated virtue with pain and he will feel that vice is the only realm of pleasure. Then he will scream that his body has vicious desires of its own which his mind cannot conquer, that sex is sin, that true love is a pure emotion of the spirit. And then he will wonder why love brings him nothing but boredom, and sex–nothing but shame.”

Now go out and express some value.

Stein · 04:42 PM

I'd maybe agree with this is if it applied to serious monogamous relationships, but not just to casual sex. In fact it seems to conflate the two, which doesn't apply these days. Casual sex really doesn't have much or any personal or emotional intimacy normally, and it's more visceral and instinctual than intellectual. If I went out on the pull in a club only ever intending so sleep with my intellectual, spiritual philosophical equal then I'd have a lot less fun.

It also seems a little contradictory to me. It's good to say to be expressive instead of results based and to not use sex for self esteem sure, but then saying that your sexual partners are a direct reflection of yourself and deepest internal values flies in the face of that a bit. They aren't.

The problem with a new guy thinking this it attaches this weighty philosophical significance to casual sex, good/bad interactions, rejections and so on. The converse of saying
"a man’s sexual choice is the result and the sum of his fundamental convictions. Tell me what a man finds sexually attractive and I will tell you his entire philosophy on life. Show me the woman he sleeps with and I will tell you his valuation of himself."
is that a WOMAN'S sexual choice is a reflection of her valuation of herself relative to you. New guys in general get rejected a LOT. Even good guys get rejected, and it can be caused by anything: her having a bad day, you having a bad day, a boyfriend, a dumb remark etc. But if a new guys are interpreting sexual selection as a result of internal value, they'll end up thinking the rejection is due to him being beneath the objective standard of every girl it doesn't go well with, which isn't helpful or true. You see what I mean?