Impressed by Jaz's Chivalry!
 

So I read Jaz's thread about being approached by girls, more so when he was with another girl, yet keeping a gentleman, he turned them down.

So lets talk about being a gentleman, manners....

I always try to open doors, etc...but what more can we do?

Being, not doing, Cha

Say THANKYOU. It pisses me off when I open a door some f*cker and they don't acknowledge my thought.

There's no more you can do other than treat everyone with consideration, including guys.

I subscribe to the notion of "Do unto others..."

The other day I had this thought that perhaps I should try and make other people's days better if I could(which I did on this day by complementing my mum's cooking haha). I think there's a lot of things you can do, basic pleases and thank yous go a long way but also taking an interest in people and complementing them on something they've put effort into works well.

Yes me too, I've started saying ''nice manners''

You mean why do I get annoyed when people don't thank me? I guess because it costs nothing.

- I heard Max Mosley paid quite a lot for them actually

This thread was supposed to bring some discussion and ideas about chivalry, good manners and being a gentleman....no one has yet put anything positive forward

Here is my peice: http://www.puaforum.co.uk/seduction-...man-guide.html. Though I agree with Jaz and wouldn't do most of this stuff in normal situations

Jaz when I was reading that and saw the "chivalry dead" bit I thought you were going to follow it up with "and women killed it"

"Chivalry is dead and women killed it" I believe thats a quote from some comedian although their name escapes me at this moment in time.

I think what is important to take from Jaz's post and others is that chivalry is fine, if you are like that to your mates and everyone, if you change who you are to try "impress" a hot girl, you are coming from a place of needy AFC territory.

I tend to do things like hold the door for people etc, but I do it to anyone. So it never should come across as needy. If anyone got a problem with that, thats their loss not mine.

Ok cool.....so you wouldnt be opening a car door for them!?

i open a door for girls and say... GO ON... i dont expect a thank you i expect them to do as they are told

Hahahaha....! And where's Retro and Simply David.

So do I, but not at restaurants.

^ chivalry at its best

Why not?

Because she might not put out

Hahahahaha!

Ok, I know this is going to sound radical and completely crazy - but what if having a meal with her and enjoying her company was satisfying enough?

Well you have that either way, so feel free to pay.

I suppose you would have that either way.

But if you really liked someone, then you would be happy to make the gesture of paying for her? You would be happy to do so if you really liked her - as long as the gesture wasn't out of neediness or desperation (bit too strong of a word maybe) for her to like you back?

Really depends on the context, but on a first date you'll be strangers, and paying for her is implicitly turning the interaction into a trade i.e. you have gone out of your way to do something for her, which like it or not places an obligation on her to return the favour. This is why a lot of girls don't like it when you insist on paying. It also reduces their agency by not acknowledging their ability to pay their own way.

Obviously there will be exceptions to this depending on logistics, and I heard the traditional courtship process follows this pattern. There will undoubtedly be girls who respond positively to this treatment, but I would question their values and motivations. It establishes a dynamic of her company being your reward and access to your wealth being her reward. It could just be that I don't have any wealth, but this doesn't seem like an ideal arrangement to me.

Sure, I agree with what you say there Undercat. But the scenario I had in mind would be a first date with someone you knew quite well (e.g. someone you work with), where there would be no ambiguity regarding your intentions to her.

So you're earning the same wage?

Also if you really do know her well chances are she's already made her mind up about you, and barring something extraordinary a date's not going to change her mind much. If she does like you, it's simply a matter of not fucking up and putting the moves on in time. Who pays is a comparatively small detail. If it would be easier for you, offer, but don't insist.

Although I imagine you'd feel foolish if you ended up paying for someone who earned the same wage as you and they told you they liked you better as a friend afterward.

Interesting point.